Help with Shape builder - mapping to a key / fader

[nrosten]

Hi All,

Ok i read the section on chases etc and still none the wiser, after playing for hours in the simulator / vis hitting some brick wall. Guessing I am missing a really simple step..

for ref all this applies to titan mobile V5 (soon be V6 when its out)

anyways all I want to do for some quick and easy shows is say select 8 moving heads which are in a nice circle around the centre of the rig, apply maybe a shape such as circle to the P&T and maybee a color shape to mix it up, then apply this pattern to a fader for use or a step in a chase?

I can easily get all the effects I want running but its the saving it to a chase or static key which I seem to be messing up.

I am sure this is very simple and I am just being a bit daft on the recording front but any pointers would be greatly appreaciated.

A side note - is there any conflict for example having a shape generator on say 8 moving heads running alongside a seperate shape on a second bunch of say 4 washes or this not possible.

Many Thanks
Neil

[niclights]

It should be as simple as setup the effect as you want followed by Record, choose type (ie. cue/chase/cue-list) and then destination handle, either physical or playbacks workspace. In the case of chases and lists you would then select the same handle a second time or hit [append step] to actually record the cue.

To help you further it may be useful if you detail all the steps you are currently trying along with what you expect to happen.

Regarding multiple shapes/fixtures this should be no problem. In a situation where two cues are active with a shape that shares the same fixture(s) and the same attribute then a latest takes priority rule is applied.

[nrosten]

Thanks Nic

Got it working - Was doing it in reverse, ie choosing record / hitting the button / fader and then fiddling with the shapes .. did nothing.

just selected 8 fixtures / shape / applied circle and then a dimmer shape and a color one to liven it up a bit and then hit the record / button ..viola .. its just my old school programming brain working wrong way round ..

I will try the chase part now, I assume for example a circle shape would effectively play 1 whole rotation before moving onto next step which may for example have a different setup?

Thanks for the swift response again at such an unearthly hour!

Neil

[niclights]

You're welcome.

Chase speed will determine when it advances to the next step. The speed of the shape will determine how much happens in that time. At the moment I can't think of any way to achieve a precise cycle (or single-shot) of a pattern. In this case you would probably be better off not using shapes.

Note that in the current software shapes in chases will not fade between steps regardless of crossfade setting. In cue-lists they will fade according the fade times.

[nrosten]

Thanks Nic,

yea its not pretty in a chase, to be honest Its only for a few quick and dirty programs which look half decent to hold it up until I get the time for some proper manual chases - the move in dark update be useful for this one.

In regards to the shape where is the speed determined ? I tried setting the speed / shape on fader in the playback options which did slow it down but also had the same effect of also dimming it also. I assume some global setting which defaults the fader to a dimmer. I am thinking for easy use for staff onsite to add a load of programs to a playback window touch button with an obvious graphic to describe - is there any obvious way to get a global speed fader which can control the speed of any program ? going off topic while I read the manual properly.

Thanks
Neil

[niclights]

Shape speed is determined when you create the shape. Speed on fader then gives proportional control but, as you say, has the problem of conflicting with dimmer if both exist on the same fader. Commonly you would solve this by separating out dimmer and shapes to different faders but with v6 you will also have the option of multiple speed masters each of which can be assigned to as many playbacks as you like.

[nrosten]

got the shape thing more or less sorted, can get some fairly easy effects with minor effort if you pile a few up on top of each other.
In regards to button mapping is there a way to assign a shape (or anything else for that matter) to a button without the button being sticky (ie pressing it once to turn on .pressing it again to turn off)

Idea being I have a load of led bars which have some nice fast chases which ideally would like on a button that must be held down in order for it to work, bit like old school days of having a flood on a touch button which could be pressed when needed or a for a quick burst of smoke ?

had a flick through manual and forums and not clear sure if a this kind of button operation is possible.

Thanks
Neil

[niclights]

Set the button to 'flash'.

[nrosten]

ok silly question but how ? i found the key profile which gives me
run
takeover
program

and against all of these it says swop flash latch in square brackets but cannot seem to to select anythign which sets it to flash - unless ime looking at wrong options?

having a thicky moment clearly as the manaul is not a lot of help on this one as it just mentions key profiles and stops dead.

ta
Neil

[nrosten]

ok think i sussed it - create a new key profile and set the button be it blue / grey / touch to flash or whatever .. bah thanks!

[nrosten]

am i also right in thinking if i set the priority to high it will override any other normal programs with a lower priority ?

ie got a running program with 8 scans doing a chase, then press a flash button which moves all 8 scans to a defined location which ideally should override the running program until button is released?

may sound a bit odd but the venue is a roller rink and they play a lot of games which the lights can be used for such as highlighting a spot on the rink to skate to and when someone has fallen and needs medical attention etc

Thanks
Neil

[niclights]

Yes, that's correct.

However, depending on the nature of the cues you might need additional steps:

Playback 1 = Fixture at Tilt 50%
Playback 2 = Fixture at Tilt 100%

If both have the same priority then rules are LTP (latest takes priority).
Lift/Latch PB2 = Tilt 100%
Lift/Latch PB1 = Tilt 50%
Lower/Kill PB1 = Tilt remains at 50%

If PB2 is set to a higher priority it will prevent firing of lower priority while active.
Lift/Latch PB2 = Tilt 100%
Lift/Latch PB1 = Tilt 100% (ie. overriden by PB2)
Lower/Kill PB1 = Tilt still 100%

Note that in both cases on killing the last playback its value remained because of LTP rules.

To make the value automatically return to that from another active playback you need to use release masks.

With PB2 release mask set to Pan/Tilt.
Lift/Latch PB1 = Tilt 50%
Lift/Latch PB2 = Tilt 100%
Lower/Kill PB2 = Tilt 50%

(Note that release time is set in the OFF menu.)

Where the lower priority playback is a chase release masks might be unnecessary because as soon as a step fires in the chase it will set new (latest) values.
Similarly, where both playbacks contain shapes then the lower priority shape will immediately take over when the higher priority shape is killed.

Finally, if you want to stop a shape running you can use 'block shapes'.

For example:

Playback 1 = Circle Shape (Normal Prio)
Playback 2 = Block Pan/Tilt Shape (High Prio)

[nrosten]

Thanks Nic for the comprehensive replay.

I think I understand most of that and as always best way to learn / understand is to try it out, luckily now the visualiser is working super I can fiddle around my end without any worry of doing any major harm to the live system!

On the first button I tried the lights stayed stationary so may need to fiddle around with release masks and such - will have a play and try it out and update if i get stuck!

Its a refreshing change for forums to be active and have responses in less than a week, In the IT industry getting help on some 3rd party products is a nightmare and ofren you get more help from a generic google seatch than the main vendor themselves!

Thanks
Neil

[nrosten]

Hi Nic
where abouts is the 'block shapes' set?

Got it mosty working
example

got a shape gemerator chase un 4 washes running which does a basic circle / rotate the RGB - set to low priority on a fader or touch screen button.

got a touch button which points all the washes up at ceeling in a wide angle wash (to light the place up - white ceeling) and and same time it points 8 spots to one corner. this is set to high priority with release mask set to p/t and intensity

when the wash program is running and I press the touch button - all 4 washes point to ceeling as intended and my 8 spots point in intended direction - only prob is the circular shape keeps running in the new ceeling position with the rotatitng colours.
When I let go of touch button the spots go off as intented and the wash pattern returns to ground level and carry's on as intended.

I am sure its a something really simple - tried varions combinations of release masks with mostly the same results - I cannot seem to stop the washes moving when holding down the button.
its a bit odd as if i have a shape generator program running with the spots the button does indeed override positioning.

hope this makes sense!

Neil

[niclights]

You just need to add a 'Block All' shape running on all the fixtures you want to stop and merge it into the high priority cue.

Block shapes are found with all the other shapes. Try typing 'block' in the shape menu to filter the options.