Some remarks on Titan

[(iCe)]

Had a little festival this night and decided to skip classic mode and just go for Titan, even having some guest operators coming by.

I had some things I would like to discuss because I'm not sure whether it's meant to be like this or maybe I'm doing something wrong.

1. When I put the console into run mode, the fixture attribute buttons don't work any longer. I can select my fixtures and apply pallets, but selecting pan/tilt to manually adjust the values doesn't work. I found out they do work when entering the ML menu, but that's annoying.
2. As for the ML menu, it blocks the possibility to enter a fade time and then apply a pallet. That's exactly what makes it annoying
3. When stepping through a connected chase, entering the ML menu seems to disconnect the chase. Same goes for selecting fixtures, applying a pallet and then clearing the programmer.
4. When you create a cue list on a fader, that fader becomes reserved for that cue list and nothing else; right? So memories / chases programmed on different roller pages aren't available any longer?
5. I use manual stepped chases a lot. Now I found the way to program those is setting time and crossfade to 0 on a chase and select the option to never link steps. Now when I raise the fader, I have to press GO once to go to the first chase step and then press GO to advance one step in the chase. Stepping through the chase using the playback flash / selection button isn't possible, right? Also I noticed sometimes (can't reproduce it I'm afraid) a fade time would be added to the chase steps, even when speed = 0 and crossfade = 0 is shown in the display. It still had a short fadetime from somewhere and I couldn't get rid of it.
6. In general, a lot of actions required me to reconnect the chase I was stepping through, thus losing the effect on stage. Most times I would be stepping though the chase with one hand while making on the fly changes with the other one. Those changes shouldn't interfere with the chase stepping going on; that should always proceed.


That's all I can think of right now, maybe I'll add some thing tomorrow when sleeping has done it's work

[niclights]

1) Yes, it's true. This will be available in next version. But until then you should be able to work in program mode ok. Restrictions are that you cannot toggle profiles easily, no tap tempo softkey and preset handles enter the programmer.

2) I'm guessing the only reason you were in ML menu was for attribute access? If so then just stay in program mode for now.

3) Also fixed in next version. But remember there is option to use quick palette and not need to select fixtures.

4) No, but it might seem that way since cue-lists can fire without raising the fader. To kill hold <shift> and press associated swop key. You can also set fader to kill at zero via playback options.

5) I agree there needs to be a way to manually snap through the steps of a normal linked chase after it has been stopped. To ensure snap with unlinked chase check the timing for each step via unfold - there must be something there. You can assign [go] to the flash or swop key via key profiles.

6) So, until next version use program mode, use key profiles for manual stepping and try to use quick palettes as much as possible (obviously not necessarily an option if you haven't programmed the show!).

[(iCe)]

Thanks nic, that answer clears up a lot of things again. I'll see if I can find some time to play around with the 1.3 beta to check out those new features. By the way, after installing a beta version; is it easy to revert back to the stable release? Uninstalling via config panel/software and reinstall again? Or should I use the 1.2 recovery disk to do this.

[niclights]

(Unofficially) there is no problem in installing different versions over the top of each other. I have done this many times both on console testing and offline. Procedure should be as simple as boot, close software, run installer, shutdown and restart. You do not need to uninstall first. Obviously this all comes with the disclaimer of the accepted risks in using beta software but personally I do consider it stable at this stage. I think it is always good practice to keep backups of important files just in case though. ie. showfiles, vis theatres & modified personalities/shapefile.

Note that showfiles are essentially backwards/forwards compatible between the two except that due to a change in the release function these particular settings do not port.

[(iCe)]

But general programming would work in 1.2 and 1.3, regardless of in which version the show was first created?

[niclights]

Yes. I should say this is in my experience and specific to between these versions. For obvious reasons there could be problems taking shows backwards through versions and I don't think any guarantees can be made but going forwards should always work.

[(iCe)]

I like to add a couple of things:
1) Cue overlap cannot be altered (see the other post about chases for this)
2) Deleting more fixtures from a patch is very annoying because the console automatically leaves patch mode once you've deleted one fixture. Maybe I had the wrong approach or something; but pressing Patch, Delete and then double selecting a fixture deletes it; but also makes the console leave patch mode.
3) I was wondering if the priority mode could also include HTP fade-outs. It would be great to be able to create a fader which performs a fly-out and also a timed fade-out of all HTP channels. Perhaps a faded black-out could be acheived as well. But as far as I could find, HTP is still highest takes percedence without counting in the priority level?

The rest of the 2.0 software is great. I do wonder if you guys really use the VDU, and if so; for what purpose? Since I already label everything on the console, I don't in the software. Futhermore, I find it hard to link an onscreen playback with the actual playback; I would have to look up the number to see which one is which. Scrolling the scollbar and seeing what's been written on there is much easier if you ask me.

[niclights]

1) Yes it can, but it cannot be set lower than 10% and attempting to do so will result in resetting to previous value. Certainly I would think 0% is an illegal setting which would effectively fire all chase steps at once (infinitely if looping!) Perhaps this could benefit from a warning icon for invalid entry?

2) True. Although given the destructive nature of patch delete it might be best this way to avoid accidents? You can latch menu to workaround.

3) Have you tried mode3?

I do use the VDU. I understand what you are saying about the relationship between console and HUD, but it is useful for a number of reasons:

In day to day use I find ability to see all chase speeds/xfade settings very useful, especially when presetting between songs. I tend to have the blue key setup as tap-tempo and I can check at a glance if everything is roughly the same speed and what is set to snap/fade.
I also find the intensity meter particularly handy for checking chase speeds on a busy stage (perhaps prior to soloing said chase). And monitoring intensity values is easier than on the LCD grid because you can see the fixture it relates to.

For programming I use it to double-check items before deletion and, in a similar way to intensity levels, I personally find the selection highlights easier to see here especially when used with selection patterns.

I could add to this things like shape information when programming and setting fixture order.


Perhaps I have just got used to this over time, but I did operate a fast-paced show last year with a development version of 1.0 where I had no time to label the desk at all, referring directly the HUD instead. At the time I was actually surprised how well this worked. Olie was witness to this!

Don't forget that you can resize the HUD elements and this can make all the difference. For instance I deliberately setup a small gap between the two rollers. I also make certain that the size of the roller areas is correct to see the maximum information - otherwise it can be much less useful. Similarly (assuming using 'bottom third' view) I do increase the height of the preset sections slightly from default. The size of the screen is obviously important too. I now use a 19" widescreen which has almost exactly the same width as the roller area.

[(iCe)]

Thanks again!

1) I guess I should have read the manual. There's another thing though; why don't the manual options in Titan (on the console) work? There there (manual, latest release notes, etc.) but clicking them doesn't do anything. Simple adobe reader with a few PDF's would be a good start.

2) Hmm, I think the fact that you have to confirm the delete action by either double clicking the fixture button or confirming in the display should be enough?

3) Nope, will do next show.

And then the VDU: maybe your right and it's just a matter of getting used to it. Perhaps you could show me some screenshots of your VDU lay-out, as I'm curious on how your actual setup looks like.

[Olie]

1) It sounds like you are selecting the manual from the wrong location. The option you are clicking on should have been removed. You open the manual by clicking on the help icon (question mark) on the desktop. If this does not work then you may want to run the v2.0 recovery disk as it will ensure everything is updated correctly.

2) The main reason it exits the delete menu is because you have the latch capability which allows you to stay in the menu. This provides consistency across the desk. The latch function is no work around, it is the function. You can also now range delete which allows you to select more than one fixture at a time to delete.

3) Will add the cross-fade to priorities, makes sense since swop is included.

[niclights]

2) The main reason it exits the delete menu is because you have the latch capability which allows you to stay in the menu. This provides consistency across the desk. The latch function is no work around, it is the function. You can also now range delete which allows you to select more than one fixture at a time to delete.

I think the problem is not that it exits the delete menu, but that it also exits the patch menu when you didn't ask it to. The workaround was to latch the patch menu.

[(iCe)]

1) It sounds like you are selecting the manual from the wrong location. The option you are clicking on should have been removed. You open the manual by clicking on the help icon (question mark) on the desktop. If this does not work then you may want to run the v2.0 recovery disk as it will ensure everything is updated correctly.

2) The main reason it exits the delete menu is because you have the latch capability which allows you to stay in the menu. This provides consistency across the desk. The latch function is no work around, it is the function. You can also now range delete which allows you to select more than one fixture at a time to delete.

3) Will add the cross-fade to priorities, makes sense since swop is included.

1) Well I gues it wasn't deleted I'll try the other one, but I'm pretty sure the toolbar Help option is there too. I used the 2.0 recovery disk for install by the way, so the problem is in there too.

2) I overlooked the latch option I think, but I agree on niclights that it's odd the console exists two menu layers (patch - delete) on itself without being told to. Having to manually latch that menu to keep it on there is an extra step which I find awkward.

3) Thanks, manually editing the chase steps took up 50% of my total programming time.

[Olie]

I think the problem is not that it exits the delete menu, but that it also exits the patch menu when you didn't ask it to. The workaround was to latch the patch menu.

I see your point, will fix (#16163)

[niclights]

Cool and the gang.

And re. help, the Titan window has had those legacy menus for a while but help & release notes are available from the shell icon as a drop-down menu. But since they are part of the shell it may well be necessary to have run recovery disk to get them.

[(iCe)]

Could someone clarify how the latch option works? I couldn't find it that quick while programming yesterday. I tried all intuitive options like avo + menu button / view + menu button, but that didn't seem to do anything.