Releasing colour back to previous colour

Questions or discussions about the Titan and classic consoles and software.

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nflutter
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Joined: 17 Oct 2012, 20:37

Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby nflutter » 02 Mar 2022, 21:07

I'm trying to record a cue that flashes a colour then fades back to previous colour. I've recorded a cue with just colour info in, set key profile to Nightclub and set release mask to colour. It releases back to locate value not the previous colour. What am I missing? Thanks
nflutter
Posts: 42
Joined: 17 Oct 2012, 20:37

Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby nflutter » 05 Mar 2022, 17:12

OK guessing that's not possible,
I see it works if I have a playback with int and col as my initial look, and then another playback that has a different colour that has release mask set to release the colour but I use colour pallettes a lot when busking and say I want a 'strobe all spots in white' hit on an executor then it doesn't work. The intensity release works as home is open but the colour releases back to home (open col) too which I don't want, I want to go back to my previous pallette colour.

Is there another way to achieve this?
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niclights
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Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby niclights » 05 Mar 2022, 17:58

Currently, clearing a selection will cause it to release to default values. If you avoid selecting/clearing the related fixtures you should find it works as expected. The way I do this is to use quick palettes (ie. apply palettes without a fixture selection). This can be limiting though and I do think this wrong.
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Andrew Palmer
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Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby Andrew Palmer » 05 Mar 2022, 19:52

This problem is a real pain.

If another playback was determining to colour (e.g., blue) before you 'flashed' another playback causing the colour to change (e.g. to white), then it is possible to set the release of the 'flash' playback so that after the white flash it went back to blue.

This is far from releasing it back to whatever was there previously, because it would always go back to blue. However, it might be better than it staying at white.

As far as I know, a playback flash can only release back to another pre-existing playback. Otherwise, it goes back to the 'Power On' value (rather than the 'Locate' value I seem to remember - although I might be wrong here).

To this end, I have a playback, set to run on start-up, which sets the colour of all my fixtures I might use for flashes to blue. This playback remains active, and gives released playbacks something to release to. It does not hinder me in any way, so firing palettes, other playbacks, or using the programmer still works as normal.

Another trick I use is to program flashes in a different way. I can't remember the exact details off hand, but it's along the lines of using additive colour shapes, fixed at a whatever phase results in 100%, at zero BPM. Doing this for each LED colour means that the colours are flashed at maximum without having to change the colour values, thus avoiding the original problem. Flashing to any other colour (as long as each colour is at 0% or 100%) is also possible if subtractive shapes are used as well. What I find really good is to flash the white colour (LED) to 100% and all the others to 0%, to achieve a nice cold white. If you (or anyone else) needs more information on this, let me know and I'll fire up the system to check.
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Andrew Palmer
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Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby Andrew Palmer » 05 Mar 2022, 20:12

Just to clarify my previous comment, I use the permanently-on blue playback to get me back to blue after I use a rainbow effect (which required me to set R, G and B to 50%), and I use the additive/subtractive colour shapes to do my flashing (which avoids the original problem by not having to change the colour values).
revenant
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Joined: 25 Oct 2020, 14:36

Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby revenant » 05 Mar 2022, 21:09

nflutter wrote:I use colour pallettes a lot when busking and say I want a 'strobe all spots in white' hit on an executor then it doesn't work. The intensity release works as home is open but the colour releases back to home (open col) too which I don't want, I want to go back to my previous pallette colour.

Is there another way to achieve this?

If I'm understanding this correctly, recording (at least) the colour as a singe frame key frame shape will give you the result you are trying to achieve.

For example...

1. Select fixtures
2. [Shapes And Effects] [Key Frame Shapes] [Create]
3. Set the colour you require
4. [Add Frame] [Finish Recording Frames]
5. Set the strobe rate you require
6. <Record> [Create Memory] (Select a handle to record playback to)
7. Set release mask of the playback to include Intensity

You could record both the colour and strobe rate into the single frame key frame shape negating the need for the release mask, however, I would normally recommend setting the strobe rate in the cue/memory directly as it provides for the possibility of variable rate strobing control if placed onto a (mode 2) fader playback.
nflutter
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Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby nflutter » 06 Mar 2022, 15:50

The colour playback is a safe idea but I busk almost everything and I'm very used to using pallettes all the time, even my opening colour looks are nested pallettes so I have a complete new colour look for each number and I use a pallette fade time for a smooth change, I only use playbacks for more rehearsed shows when I know whats coming, otherwise I'm making everything up as I go and pallettes really work for me.
Also I have a Mobile so limited faders, I have intensities/chases in cuelists on my faders, pallettes for all my LTP changes and use executors for all my 'hits', works for me.

It's a real shame that the release feature doesn't have an option on what it releases to.... locate values or previous value, maybe something that can be looked at? It opens up a whole load of really easy to setup and flexible options and good for mobile users who have limited playbacks to hand.

The Key frame shape idea works really well, thanks. It does what I need, flashes a look and then returns to previous look even if I've cleared programmer, that's going to be my go to for now. The only limitation I'm finding over a cue flash is that I can't set fade times for the executor, well I can but it doesn't work like a cue flash fade time, maybe I can do something in the effect editor, ideally I want a snap in then fade over a second or 2 for the out.

Thanks for your ideas, like I said it would be a nice little addition to the toolbox if we had a release to option.
revenant
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Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby revenant » 06 Mar 2022, 16:54

nflutter wrote:The only limitation I'm finding over a cue flash is that I can't set fade times for the executor, well I can but it doesn't work like a cue flash fade time, maybe I can do something in the effect editor, ideally I want a snap in then fade over a second or 2 for the out.

What have you tried that didn't work for you?

As you are triggering from an executor and don't require the variable rate strobing control, I would think that:

1. Setting playback [Options]->[Effects]->[Shape Size] = [Fader]
2. Setting playback [Options]->[Handle]->[Key Profile] = some profile that has the executor action as "Timed Flash"
3. Setting playback [Options]->[Times]->[Flash Fade In] = 0
4. Setting playback [Options]->[Times]->[Flash Fade Out] = 1 or 2 (dependent on requirements)

Would give you what you need for colour only key frame shapes?

I think the names of some of these options may have changed over software versions so the names you see in the Playback View workspace may be slightly different but should still be self evident.
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niclights
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Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby niclights » 06 Mar 2022, 17:57

As long as you setup palettes so that they apply to specific fixtures and select them without a fixture selection it will release to the palette as desired. While I agree it is frustrating that selecting/clear will cause those fixtures to release to power on I busked hundreds of shows using quick palettes like this ever since release was a thing. Occasionally I might use a selection meaning I would need to reassert a quick palette but otherwise it worked well without needing to mess about with key frame shapes etc. The key frame shapes is a nice solution but is limiting in that you can't change the fade time on the fly (when busking I make heavy use of this) and you can't filter by selection etc. (albeit breaking the release). Alternatively you could set the playbacks to mode 2 instead of release colour. This won't be affected by select/clear.
nflutter
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Joined: 17 Oct 2012, 20:37

Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby nflutter » 06 Mar 2022, 19:26

revenant wrote:What have you tried that didn't work for you?


My bad, I missed the Shape = fader option, now it works as I expected, great workaround. Thanks

niclights wrote:As long as you setup palettes so that they apply to specific fixtures and select them without a fixture selection it will release to the palette as desired. While I agree it is frustrating that selecting/clear will cause those fixtures to release to power on I busked hundreds of shows using quick palettes like this ever since release was a thing.


I guess it's just an habitual thing, I probably clear too often! Thanks.
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niclights
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Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby niclights » 06 Mar 2022, 19:55

Pressing clear alone won't make any difference. It's fixtures that have been selected prior to clear that are affected. I forgot to mention that perhaps the best thing about using quick palettes is that they are, as the name suggests, quick as there is no need to select before (or clear after). So not only does using them avoid the issue but should also be faster. Certainly I found sometimes this made all the difference when busking. One button gets me straight there, two with manual timing.
nflutter
Posts: 42
Joined: 17 Oct 2012, 20:37

Re: Releasing colour back to previous colour

Postby nflutter » 06 Mar 2022, 20:20

Yes you're right, if you use a quick palette it doesn't release to locate values so does do exactly what I need and you're right it's quicker too. Again a habit thing of selecting fixtures before applying palettes... even when I don't need to! I'll work on that.

Just a little strange the way Titan handles release differently for a selected palette and a quick palette, not sure if there's a reason for that, my moneys still on a 'release to' locate or previous value option in the future!

Thanks again for your invaluable help.

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