[Resolved] 90 degree fixture rotation thing

[TWC]

I've noticed some discrepancies with certain fixtures where the behaviour is different in capture to thier real life behavoiur.
Is this the right place to mention that or is it a personality report I need to do?

[niclights]

For issues relating to the simulation of fixtures in the integrated Capture Visualiser window please submit a personality bug report by clicking on the bug icon next to the relevant Titan personality in the online Fixture Personality Library providing as much information as possible. Please be aware that the accuracy of the integrated Capture fixture simulation is dependent on the fixture details available within the capabilities of the integrated visualiser. If documentation containing pan/tilt calibration information is not available we can provide a guide in response to the bug report which you can follow and then return the results of.

[clublights]

I believe Tom is referring to the way that external capture and internal capture will be off by 90 deg on the y rotation meaning you can not get fixtures to match up when on console link .

[niclights]

This was relating to Capture fixture calibration. The offset by 90° compared to stand-alone Capture should be fixed in this version.

[TWC]

For me the confusion comes from there being no standardisation of how we define what is the front of the fixture. As we know certain fixtures orientate themselves so when they are set to 50/50 the yoke is set to tilt from stage right to stage left when you physically rig them with the display facing downstage.

For example I own quite a few chauvet rogue series fixtures and these are a prime example of this problem. Thr omega brackets can be fitted in either orientation and there's no arrow saying which is the front. When I place these fixtures on the floor I face the displays s/r and when i hang them I face the display S/L. This was they all love the same direction when they move. And certain other brands of fixtures I own I follow a similar method.

The problem i had with certain types of these fixtures is i was physically rotating them like I mentioned but in capture I didn't need to or had to flip them 180 on I or 90. Or most commonly minus 90.

Also there are discrepancies in the position of the lightning bolt symbol. It's not always correct in capture and the plot symbol often shows he told in the wrong orientation too

What it needs to solve this "issue" is for somebody to draw a line in the sand and have a set of defined rules how fixtures are orientated, where the display is, where the power connection is, which orientation the yoke is on the plot symbol and all stick to it.

I'm not being picky or anything and this is not meant to come across as rude to the team that create the personality files. They can only work with whatever data is supplied to them, the issue is matching it to the real life physical attributes of the fixture.

Regards, Tom.

[clublights]

But you cant set a rule like that as the manufacturer of the fixtures don't


Example ( yes old fixtures but I know these off the top of my head ) Studio Color, the "front" of the fixture has the display and the tilt/pan is inline with it and the power comes off the left side, elation 15r spot pros , if the pan and tilt are the same as the Studio color the display is on the left and power is on the right .


Sometimes you just gotta wiggle the fixture , set it how you want.. maybe use tilt or pan inverts ( under the beam attribute when wheels = vis)

[clublights]

In the long run if you find a fixture that is not correct in capture compared to the real world you need to report this to ether capture or submit a personality bug report to Avo. '

AS you know both are responsive to fixing issues... if they know about them

[niclights]

I think all the matters is that there is something we can use as a reference point and that the simulation matches the real world fixture. The latter is down to having sufficient information which is rarely documented by the manufacturers but can be provided by an end user. The former is the LCD display/menu which is represented as a large rectangle on one side of the Capture fixture models.

[clublights]

Doesn't help that some times the manuals are not even correct to the real world fixture. I had someone get really made at me because of that . Some folks ( not saying you are one tom) Don't get that the personalities are built on manuals not real fixtures brought in and tested.

[TWC]

in situations like that if the fixture didnt match up, if it was something i knew i wouldn't ever see again i would probably just adjust the attribute file and save it as a different name.

the instances of the fixture being 90 degrees out is a difficult one for all the good reasons you both mentioned, i know how tough it is getting proper data from manufacturers, half the time they dont even understand thier own products. don't even start me on the subject of gobo rotation and index on the chauvet stuff it's a source of immense irritation for me.

while i'm on the subject, the other little gem that i do is when i'm using an unfamiliar rig in a venue (fixture exchanges/unknown rigs etc) i tend to invert the pan on fixtures that turn clockwise when pan is increased, and invert the tilt on fixtures that move towards you when the tilt is increased, there is method in my madness and it relates to the fixtures all responding by moving the same direction, this saves so much time when updating position palettes and makes 'on the fly' position corrections more predictable. I would dearly love for the personality file to have the clockwise/anticlockwise & towards/away data shown somewhere and for the channel inversion i mentioned to be automated when exchanging fixtures but this is far beyond the scope of this topic.

[clublights]

I pretty much do the same but ( and this may be the same ) when I put my finger on the wheel from the top the pan goes left when I go left and ditto for right , and if I grab he tilt wheel from the right side of it up is away down is towords me . ( from a locate) i HATE if fixtures get set up and don't do this but a quick offset update or recording new locate values fixes that on show with a quickness.