The Avolites Discussion Forum

Newbie question: How do I set a fader to control something other than intensity?

Specifically, when I roll a fader up, I want it to snap the dimmer immediately to 100%, but give me control over the strobe rate from 0-100%.

Possible? What's the best way to set that up? Thanks!

To fade LTP attributes by fader you can set the playback to mode 2 in [Edit Times]. This will proportionally fade from the existing source value to the target value recorded in the playback. When the source is a fixed value (for example 'Open') and the target is a range (ie. 'Strobe %') it will switch to the lowest value of the range when the fader reaches the trigger level and then fade up to the target. Where the source and target are both separate ranges (ie. CW/CCW spin) then it will attempt to fade out the first range then jump to the start of the second range and fade that in.

However, dimmer will always natively fade by fader. You can change this behaviour with curves but currently they operate over everything in a playback, so a curve that makes the dimmer snap on will also make the strobe snap on.

I have found a way though:

- Create two playbacks - PB1 = dimmer @ full, PB2 = strobe value (these could be stored out of the way in the playbacks workspace if required)
- Set PB1 curve to 'Always On' in [Playback Options]
- Set PB2 to mode 2
- Create a cuelist on a fader with one empty cue.
- View the cuelist playback and click on the autoload cell
- Select PB1 and PB2 then exit
- In the [Playback Options] for the cuelist toggle [Fader Mode Intensity Kill At 0] and [Fire First Cue Enabled]
- Finally manually set the shutter value to open (at least for demonstration purposes)

Lifting the cuelist playback fader will now act as if you are lifting PB1 and PB2 faders together and each will follow their respective rules, so PB1 with the dimmer will follow the 'Always On' curve and snap to full as soon as the fader gets past the trigger point and PB2 will act as Mode 2 and fade in the strobe value proportionally. Fire First Cue Enabled avoids the need to [Go] the first cue and Kill At 0 automatically releases the list again when you pull the fader to zero.

Hello,

While trying to reproduce this, I realized I have to modify PB1 fade mode in order to have it behave as expected when its curve is set to Always on.
Leaving it to default mode (fade mode 0) gives me a dimmer attribute fading proportionally to the fader position, as if curve wasn't modified.
Same result with Relay on>50% curve (raising fader gives a seemingly linear dimmer curve, nonetheless).

At first I concluded that special curves do not apply in mode 0 for some strange reason, but using a Relay off>50% curve does have an impact on my pb in mode 0 :
it gives me a 0% dimmer all the way - where, if I get the curve right, it should instead gives me dimmer at 255 on the first half of the fader.
So, then I thought maybe the problem is my cue has a zero fade time and, still for strange reason, this prevents the curve to be applied correctly in mode 0.
But that's not the case either, as setting a fade in time also gives strange results :
with a, say, 3s fade time, Relay on>50% curve and my fader at 20% gives me 3s in the dark, then a dimmer at 20%,
whereas the Relay off>50% curve and a 20% fader ends up in 3s of dimmer 20% outputted, then a blackout...

Everything goes fine and as expected, however, as soon as I switch to mode 1 - which is nice but still confuses me :

Mode 0 is 'timed fade in' and, as I see mode 1 ('timed fade in and out') as just a 'mode-0-plus-fadeout-times-active', I fail to grasp the logic of the behaviour of those curves in mode 0...
Add to my confusion the fact that flash button applied on a pb with a Relay off>50% curve outputs a 100% dimmer (whatever the chosen fade mode).

So what's the correct explanation for this ?

I could have sworn that it worked in mode 0 when I tested. I must have changed the mode without realising.

But in fairness this has been the case for dimmers since curves were introduced. If you apply a timed fade to an LTP attribute then the curves do apply correctly in mode 0. I think the confusion comes from the fact that it was not originally implemented with HTP in mind but in reality this is probably the main application (albeit now somewhat superceded by curves at a fixture level).
Personally I do think this needs to change. 'Special' cases like relay off and always on are further complicated by how it should interact with the trigger point on a fader. Flashing relay off is probably a bug.

Anyway, I think the most important thing for now is that you are correct that for the solution to work you must also change the dimmer playback to mode 1.

Anyway, I think the most important thing for now is that you are correct that for the solution to work you must also change the dimmer playback to mode 1.

Yes indeed.
Just trying to make sense out of it - as, usually, something not going as expected means I get something wrong...

Thanks for your reply.

This is great information. Thank you!

I sincerely appreciate you guys taking the time to write all this up. I'm not entirely sure that I understand everything that's happening, but it does work!